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Author Topic: 2022 March MSC  (Read 10126 times)

Masse24

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #30 on: January 31, 2022, 01:41:09 PM »
Quote from: blubayou on January 31, 2022, 02:42:30 AM
[/color][/i] !H  , 1NT; 2NT, 3 !S " -- Can hardly wait for a  quiz question  using that little bugger!
Impossible.
Not gonna happen without a special agreement.
Speaking of which, a three-card limit-raise with shortage would be a cool use for it. 3NT would then ask where, with LMH responses. But otherwise . . .
Impossible.

Thinking about it further. I suppose, strictly speaking, that if it is defined as a transfer to clubs, then that's what it is. But in this exact auction, can someone please construct a hand that would bid this way? Especially since 1M - 3 !C is invitational?

I still think the term "impossible" applies.  ;)
« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 06:04:39 PM by Masse24 »
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kenberg

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #31 on: January 31, 2022, 01:53:16 PM »
Quote from: blubayou on January 31, 2022, 02:42:30 AM
Hi, Ken:    As you consider, factor in that 3C, 3D AND 3 HEARTS[!?!]  are all transfers.. I KNOW  it's in print where it ought to be--because seeing it astonished me.   So  3D  is a TRANSFER,  not a check-back for 4 --or even three-- hearts.   If you don't buy my ranting that her intention MAY be to bail in a  (6/7-2 fit) partial,  then  via con Dios, compadre,  but this is not a gadget letting us get away  with  raising the 5-11 1NT to two  when  5=4 in the majors
   Bulletin  BWS section G--about halfway down : " One of a major — one notrump — two notrump is invitational; responder's continuation of three of a suit other than opener's is a transfer." 
This appears to include     "1 !H  , 1NT; 2NT, 3 !S " -- Can hardly wait for a  quiz question  using that little bugger!

I missed that! I saw the "One of a major — one notrump — two notrump is invitational" under opener's rebids and didn't look at the next part, I skipped down to "later actions".

Ok, So now it's settled, I bid 4 !H. My hearts could be Kx or even Jx for my 2NT call, my hand has gotten better not worse, so 4 !H it is.


Bidding is some combination of agreements and judgment, and sometimes just hoping for the best. There were more than the usual number of hands this month where I was not so sure I understood the calls or the possible choices for my call.
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kenberg

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #32 on: January 31, 2022, 02:11:26 PM »
Todd's response came up while I was writing mine. If BWS says 1 !H - 1NT - 2NT - 3 !S a transfer to clubs then so be it.

I played my first hand of rubber bridge in 1961. At that time, a bid meant whatever Charles Goren said it meant. I got busy and didn't play much for quite a while but in the late 70s. My partner handed me a copy of Five Card Majors Western Style by Hardy. So fine, playing with her bids meant whatever Hardy said they meant. I have also played that bids mean whatever X says they mean where X has been Bergen, or Lawrence, or Steve Robinson. And SAYC, which isn't horrible. Oh, and when I play with the robots the bids mean whatever the robots say they mean. Robots are stubborn about that.

I often but not always prefer fairly natural bidding. I play sometimes with one person, other times with someone else, other times with another someone else and I don't want to have to cope with learning a different system of artificial calls for each of them.
 Here we have a contest so fine, I use whatever they tell me to use. I just missed it this time.

An interesting feature about 1 !S -1NT - 2NT - 3 !H being a trf to !C: In BWS the auction 1 !S - 3 !C is natural and invitational, the sort of hand where a non-2/1 player would probably have the auction go 1 !S - 2 !C - 2 something - 3 !C passable. So 1 !S -1NT - 2NT - 3 !H does not show six clubs and a ten count, that hand goes 1 !S - 3 !C.
It seems to me that 1 !S -1NT - 2NT - 3 !H  is not going to happen very often. Six clubs and an 8 count? Or six clubs and a 6 count? I want to play this where? I suppose it happens, maybe every ten years or so.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 02:19:56 PM by kenberg »
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Ken

kenberg

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #33 on: January 31, 2022, 02:43:44 PM »
A couple of other confusing points from this month.

On H the auction went

1 !S 1NT
2 !H 3 !H
4 !D 4 !H

What is 4 !D? Ok, back up to what was 3 !H? After 1 !S - 1NT - 2 !H it could be that NS have a !H fit, n has an 11 count, S has a 17 count. Or 18 count. It also could be that N has a 6 count and S has a 12 count.And anywhere in-between. Maybe we clearly want to play in 4 !H, maybe we clearly don't, and maybe we need 3 !H to be invitational with, say, a 10 count.

Now if 3 !h is invitational, what is 4 !D? Is S saying "Well, 2 !H was passable, and 3 !H was invitational,  but now that we have found this fit let's bid a slam"? Possible, but another case of not likely. But I suppose that's what it was.



And then there is C:
1 !C - 1 !D - X - 1 !S.

Now on this hand I, opening with 1 !C,  have a spade void but consider a hand where my shape is 4=2=3=4 and I have a 14 count. Yes, I would like to show my spades, partly because the 1 !S could be a fake bid but mostly because I have them so I would like to show them. But the 1 !S could be for real, probably is for real in most games, pard's X showed both major bu xxxx is a major and pard could have an 8 count or probably could have a six count. I can't say that I want to bid a natural 2 !S here. And we could use X to show this. I don't need X to show hearts. If I have four hearts I can bid 2 !H. My opponents have not claimed they have length in hearts and 2 !H should show the heart fit and a hand that is not totally minimal. With a 12 count I could pass. 1 !S is not apt to end the auction and there is a good chance I will be able to bid 2 !H next round saying "Yes I have a !H fit but don't expect much else".

So I think 1 !C - 1 !D - X - 1 !S - X should show four spades. Bit then what is 1 !C - 1 !D - X - 1 !S - 2 !S?  Maybe it should be !S shortness and a !H fit but I am not sure that it is.

Working on mysteries without any clues.


« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 03:46:49 PM by kenberg »
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Masse24

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #34 on: January 31, 2022, 03:42:02 PM »
Quote from: kenberg on January 31, 2022, 02:43:44 PM
A couple of other confusing points from this month.

On H the auction went

1 !S 1NT
2 !H 3 !H
4 !D 4 !H

What is 4 !D? Ok, back up to what was 3 !H? After 1 !S - 1NT - 2 !H it could be that NS have a !H fit, n has an 11 count, S has a 17 count. Or 18 count. It also could be that N has a 6 count and S has a 12 count.And anywhere in-between. Maybe we clearly want to play in 4 !H, maybe we clearly don't, and maybe we need 3 !H to be invitational with, say, a 10 count.

Now if 3 !h is invitational, what is 4 !D? Is S saying "Well, 2 !H was passable, and 3 !H was invitational,  but now that we have found this fit let's bid a slam"? Possible, but another case of not likely. But I suppose that's what it was.

That's exactly how I interpreted it.

Since the 2 !H rebid is wide-ranging (11-17 or even 18), then responder is obligated to cater to the high end with appropriate values. Say . . . a good 8 to 11. So 4 !D must be a slam probe.

Exactly what it shows is anyone's guess. But apparently opener needs help in clubs and presumably responder to be at the top of his range to go higher.

Best guess is some sort of 5=4=2=2 and 17 HCP.

So assuming responder to be near the bottom of his range (9 HCP?), that leaves partner with around 8 HCP.
« Last Edit: January 31, 2022, 03:44:49 PM by Masse24 »
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kenberg

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #35 on: January 31, 2022, 08:24:01 PM »

Enough dithering, this is it

Ken Berg
320 Quail
Sykesville MD 21784
U.S.A.

PROBLEM A: Pass
PROBLEM B: 3 Hearts
PROBLEM C: 2 Diamonds
PROBLEM D: Pass
PROBLEM E: 3 Notrump
PROBLEM F: 5 Clubs
PROBLEM G: 4 Hearts
PROBLEM H: Club Ace
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yleexotee

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #36 on: January 31, 2022, 08:33:39 PM »

PROBLEM A: 5 Clubs
PROBLEM B: 4 Hearts
PROBLEM C: 2 Spades
PROBLEM D: Pass
PROBLEM E: Pass
PROBLEM F: 3 Clubs
PROBLEM G: 4 Hearts
PROBLEM H: Club Ace
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jcreech

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #37 on: January 31, 2022, 09:51:03 PM »
SOLUTIONS FOR:
James Creech

FREDERICKSBURG VA 22407
U.S.A.

PROBLEM A: 4 Clubs
PROBLEM B: 3 Hearts
PROBLEM C: 3 Diamonds  Only change.  Although still a splinter, to be accurate, I am making a jump cue-bid, not a jump reverse.  If the opponents had not bid the suit, then it would be a jump reverse with the same meaning.  I would rather be showing my void first, but as Blu pointed out, the chance of partner misconstruing is much higher with an immediate bid of spades than diamonds.
PROBLEM D: Pass
PROBLEM E: Pass
PROBLEM F: Pass
PROBLEM G: 4 Hearts
PROBLEM H: Club Ace
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wackojack

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #38 on: January 31, 2022, 10:10:50 PM »
SOLUTIONS FOR:
Jack Goody
Guildford
England

PROBLEM A: 4 Clubs
PROBLEM B: 3 Hearts
PROBLEM C: 4 Diamonds
PROBLEM D: Pass
PROBLEM E: 3 Notrump
PROBLEM F: 3 Clubs
PROBLEM G: 3 Hearts
PROBLEM H: Club Ace
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kenberg

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #39 on: February 01, 2022, 02:08:49 PM »
With not all that much to do I checked in on what others did with F. Unsurprisingly, I am the only nut choosing 5 !C. I did not expect it to be a popular choice. A little insanity now and then is good for a person. I'll stick with it.
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jcreech

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #40 on: February 01, 2022, 07:05:10 PM »
March Results

Two in a row for Masse24, who won this month and made the honor roll. 

NAMEBW-SCORERANKMPs
Masse24     720   1   30
WackoJack     670   2   15
BabsG     650   3   10
BluBayou     650   3   10



Also participating this month were:  CCR3, Duffer66, FleuretteD, Hoki, JCreech, KenBerg, MsPhola, Peuco, VeeRee, VeredK, YleeXotee.

Congratulations to all!
« Last Edit: March 01, 2022, 01:34:15 PM by jcreech »
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Masse24

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #41 on: February 02, 2022, 05:35:56 PM »
Although not the most difficult problem, I thought Problem C was the most fun. Clearly there were going to be many possible answers. With cuebids and splinters and raises available at many levels. But the panel answers shown, in addition to the additional answers that scored are a joke. The director (I think it will be Kokish this month) saw fit to include 33 total answers receiving a score. These "scoring" responses included:
  • Pass (with a known 9 card fit)
  • 1NT (with 0517 shape)
  • 7 !S (a sooper-dooper-pooper splinter?)
  • 7NT (who the hell knows)
I suppose some of the low level non-forcing bids are a bit of a tactical gambit intending some high-level competing later.
But 7 level? Of anything? There were others equally ridiculous.

What a joke. The explanations should be priceless.  :o
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blubayou

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #42 on: February 03, 2022, 03:09:04 AM »
This is the 2nd time in a year that somebody's robot "autofill subroutine" escaped from its cage and awarded every possible call  not already discussed  a 20.  Besides the question "How can this happen",  is also  "WHO told the robot to use "20"??    But now let's look at the 3-vote winning call  which was 4 spades.   Is this exclusion rkc FOR HEARTS?  why / how??  mebbe  for CLUBS-- ok/fine  but that's not a winning answer to my mind,  unless mor than 3 panelists support it.  One of our hero contributors spoke the words 'exclusion KC" I definitely remember, but that post seems deleted.   Anyway  give that man  a 100 on problem C  for even getting in the ballpark!
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jcreech

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #43 on: February 03, 2022, 04:21:01 AM »
I am with Jock on this, as much as I hate to admit it.  4 !S simply does not make any sense as the winning call.  It may be an exclusion RKC for clubs, but hearts is the more important suit to have as the trump suit.  I would be more worried that partner would take it as the ultimate psyche reveal and pass in preference to clubs.  The bid is more fraught with danger without clear understandings than almost any other possibility.  At least 2 !S, you are playing two levels lower and partner may take a bid as a failsafe.
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Masse24

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Re: 2022 March MSC
« Reply #44 on: February 03, 2022, 04:52:31 AM »
4 !S was the first call (then 3 !S too) that came to mind for me, but I had no guts. I was afraid of the possibility it might be construed as natural. Which is why I went with the "other" splinter.

Why would 4 !S be exclusion . . . but for clubs? If you assume it is exclusion--hearts is trump.

As I mentioned upthread, fun hand.
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