2S-Pass-Pass-? 2NT is?

[kenberg]

I don't think I have ever discussed this. After 1 - Pass - Pass most people play 1NT as a balanced hand of modest strength, 11-15 being a common range. So it's different from the immediate 1NT directly over 1 . But how about 2 -Pass-Pass-2NT? It seems right to make this pretty strong. After all, you do need 8 tricks and while the 2 shows less strength than a 1 opening, the Rho's pass of 2 could be on pretty decent strength.

Here is the hand that prompted this thinking. I'll start with my hand (second position, 2 opened on my right):

T6
A43
T72
JT852

Ok, over 2 on my right I chose to Pass. Then a Pass on my left and a double by partner. Pass on my right. Yuk.
Not for the first time I was not really sure of our agreements. If 2NT would be a Lebensohl relay to 3 I could do that and then pass, but were we playing Leb here? I decided to bid 3 and hope for the best. Partner now bid 3NT. Ok, he has to play it, not me.

T6
A43
T72
JT852

AJ42
QT8
AK86
A6

The story has a happy ending. A lead would beat 3NT but W, holding 975, somehow failed to find such an obvious () lead.

I'm thinking that after 2 - Pass - Pass, the S hand could bid 2NT. I would pass and we would not get that nice +400, but it seems right.

Suppose we were playing Leb and suppose then that over partner's X I bid a Leb 2NT intending to pass the 3 . The problem is that partner is not going to be happy bidding 3   because (a) he has only Ax in and (b) the hand probably belongs in NT. Worse, if he decides that he should override the relay and raise 2NT to 3NT I will be playing it from the N hand a the opening lead will be a . Not good.

So I am thinking that the range for 2NT after 2 - Pass - Pass should be high enough to include this hand.


The play was interesting, here are all four hands:

                      T6
                      A43
                      T72
                      JT852

KQ8753                        9
975                              KJ62
Q95                              J43
K                                  Q9743

                    AJ42
                    QT8
                    AK86
                    A6

The opening lead was the K (W does not know that declarer holds AJxx and dummy has the T), taken by the A, the A is led, dropping the Q, and another to the J with W pitching a small . E wins with  the Q and leads what? He no longer has a , a would go into dummy's T8, and a is not going to succeed either. So a , ducked, W wins the Q and gets out with a . Declarer wins and leads a . taken by W, so the J is now good. E is out of and  throws a on this trick.

Declarer will now be getting two tricks, one trick, three tricks and two tricks. Well, that's 8. If W leads a we are up to 9, but W gets out with his third . Now what?

It's an interesting squeeze position. Declarer cashes his J and his last . Nine tricks have no been played and everyone must come down to four cars . E has to save two else the T will drop the 9, promoting the 8. So he comes down to KJ. But now a to the ! and another ! puts E on lead holding only the 97, with T8 on the board.

9 tricks. Not a contract anyone wants to be in.

I think 2 -Pass - Pass - 2NT - all pass is a reasonable auction, but I am not complaining about the result.

[Masse24]

I'm thinking that after 2 - Pass - Pass, the S hand could bid 2NT. I would pass and we would not get that nice +400, but it seems right.

So I am thinking that the range for 2NT after 2 - Pass - Pass should be high enough to include this hand.

Addressing only your 2NT question . . .

I assume that the range for a direct seat 2NT overcall over a weak-2 to be roughly the same as a direct seat 1NT overcall: 15-18. The same for your proposed balancing seat 2NT. So (2x) - P - (p) - 2NT is the same as (2x) - 2NT.

However, I note that both Larry Cohen and Mike Lawrence expand that range to 15-19. Both are pretty standard, vanilla theorists.

I am fine with that 15-19 range.

[kenberg]

Yes, this all seems right. I was browsing a bit on the web and it seems that it is also reasonably but not completely what people play. After 2S- Pass -Pass, 4th hand will sometimes have a 16 count or thereabout. He can hardly double if he is not prepared for likely responses, whether or not Leb is being played. The hand I posted, with its 18 count, illustrates this. 4th hand certainly wants to bid, and equally  certainly does not want to have to cope with a 3 response to a double. The solution is to bid 2NT.

It's true that sometimes partner will pass 2NT and declarer will take 9 ricks. On this hand I wold have passed 2NT partner did take 9 tricks. But it is also true that if he begins with a double and then goes on to 3NT, he will sometimes, and I think more often, take only 8 tricks.

Even in NT, not everything is point count. 15-19 allows a pass with a bad 15, and perhaps a double followed by 3NT would a good 19.

On this hand the split 3-3, the K falls stiff under the A, and my T helped produce a second trick. And still a lead would have beaten it. So 2NT passed out is a reasonable way for it to go.